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JRFC Aftermath

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I wonder if Supporters Direct actually advised them against taking JRFC and its associated debt on as the most prudent course?
 
Is it not now the time to think, what was a short time ago, the unthinkable. 2 meetings were held this week of the Northwich Clubs at one of which the 1874 Club voted democratically to change their constitution and allow a lesser form of audit, thus saving the Club several thousands of £s per annum in the process. Not being able to attend the other meeting in person, I gather that there are a number of difficult issues for the Vics fans/administration to overcome, not the least of which is the ground sharing arrangements for next season and the need to satisfy the demands of either the Evostik League or possibly the North West Counties in the likely event of relegation. In the period of time from the decision to form 1874, there has been a degree of comment on both sides , which has understandably, on a number of occasions, gone over the top. Most 1874 fans retain a large degree of affection for the old Vics and leaving that Club behind caused a lot of grief. The new administration at Vics are likely to be finding how difficult it is to finance and administer a fans run Club. If Vics are to survive at some level, would the best way forward for them be a form of amalgamation with 1874 ? We have successfully negotiated nearly 4 years of our existence and if Vics fans were to throw their lot in with us, there would be many mutual benefits. Immediately springing to mind are that from 1874's point of view an immediate boost to the fan base and access to an enlarged junior set up. From Vics' point of view they would have the benefit of an established fans run set up and the benefit of following a Club which has demonstrated that it has the infrastructure to survive at a reasonable level of non league football. There are probably many other benefits but, with good will on both sides an amalgamation should be possible, providing the Rushe aftermath is properly sorted., I know that this will not go down well with some people but it seems to me that there is only room in Northwich (or nearby) for one fan based Club playing in green. Who knows, Vics fans fearing relegation or worse, could soon find themselves supporting an amalgamated team at the same level as they currently enjoy, if 1874 gain the promotion they deserve in the near future.
 
I have to disagree with you Archie.

When we first set up 1874 we had great difficultly trying to persuade individuals and businesses that we were not Northwich Vics as their name and business record in the local area is toxic and we have made great strides to distant ourselves from that toxic brand by setting up a new Club which is building an enviable reputation for probity and doing things "the right way" and in my opinion anything that tries to undo the good work that has been done to distance ourselves from JRFC/NVFC would be a retrograde step.

The JRFC/NVFC fans who wish to see the good work being done at 1874 would be very welcome and I would be delighted to see them however their club has nothing positive, viable, enviable and their "baggage" is a handicap we can well do without.

Let them come into the light and embrace the new and exciting possibility of 1874 Northwich FC and lets bury the undead corpse of JRFC/NVFC, its debt, disgraced chairmen, and dodgy and criminal dealings.
 
Sorry Archie, agree with John Lilburne, I would not want anything to do with Vics now.... it was a tough decision to leave them, but leave them I have and couldn't be happier...
 
In practical terms how would you amalgamate?
Don't FA regulations state that when teams merge they start at the level of the lower club which could be NWCL 2 if Vics get a double relegation?
To merge would mean 74 taking on Vics debts?
As board members are elected how far would 74 members go in voting for those from Vics? Some people's history would make their position untenable.

Far more practical for 74 to come up with ideas which make Vics fans welcome and go some way to burying differences and just absorb the fan base into the current set up.

Nothing is impossible but realism would need to be in plentiful supply in this scenario!
 
totally agree with Archie time to build bridges.it is ridiculous to have two fan based clubs both representing the green side of northwich.I do not agree the vics name is toxic.the previous owners were toxic who tarnished the clubs reputation but are no longer relevant.time for an olive branch from both sides,lets get together and be the dominant force we once were.
 
virgil caine said:
totally agree with Archie time to build bridges.it is ridiculous to have two fan based clubs both representing the green side of northwich.I do not agree the vics name is toxic.the previous owners were toxic who tarnished the clubs reputation but are no longer relevant.time for an olive branch from both sides,lets get together and be the dominant force we once were.
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The problem with that being that Vics are not a fan owned club, they are 100% owned by Martin Rushe and are in administration, with a CVA yet to be put to creditors including HM revenue and customs AGAIN. This time there will be no rabbit out of the hat/wad of cash out of the Rushe families back pocket to stave it and, THIS TIME if there is any justice or common sense applied they will be wound up and be prevented from cheating the rest of the football family by being run unsustainably. THEN any Vics fans who want to go along I'm sure will be welcomed by 1874 as a sustainable fan run club!
 
Jesus's H tap dancing Christ!
I cannot believe what I have just read from Archie, Virgil ( newish member???) and SH who agreed!!
Its like the last 5 years didn't exist
I want nothing and I mean NOTHING to do with Vics again. We have our club and are moving on. Any official move for a merger and I am so far out I would rather follow Manchester Utd! FFS! Talk about missing the point, you've missed the entire speech guys!
We can amalgamate though. We'll keep the 1874 part of our name and the Northwich part of their name and obviously we are used to running a club so our board should run the newly named 1874 Northwich FC as they have a record of 3 seasons of top 4 finishes on a transparent budget.
 
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There is no possible way should the old club affiliate with 74 in a joint enterprise, if amalgamation is the possible suggestion then it would be a non starter.
If we are suggesting that current supporters of the old club join with us for the future I am confident that the welcome would be genuine.
 
Agree with Chubbs (apart from the bit about following MUFC and the apostrophe ;)). I would hate to see all the hard work which so many people have put into establishing a separate entity be dashed in a move where the only "benefit" to 74 would appear to be the existence of a junior set-up (we can disregard the "enlarged fan base" given the frequent video evidence). If they want to come and support us, in our football club, they would for the most part be made welcome, but if they want to bring their club, their debts and their tarnished reputation into the mix, then what on earth is in it for us? Other than being made the laughing stock of the NL world and risking ruining hard-fought associations built up so far in both football and local business.
 
Speaking as a fellow fan owned club member and i was at Atherton last week, i would be horrified if any true 1874 member would chuck your hat in with that lot.
You made your bed when you decided to set up your own club and rest assured you made the right decision... you will only get stronger.
These people who are proposing a merger of sorts will only poison your club from within, just my personal opinion for what it's worth.
Fcum/1874.
 
If Rushe hadn't have been caught dealing cocaine JRFC would be flying high now and their fans wouldn't have a care in the world or care where the money was coming from. They didn't have a care in the world a few months ago when Rushe agreed to hand over the club but now all of a sudden the shit has hit the fan and they want what we have worked so hard to get, a well run, respected, democratic, financially transparent, stable and sustainable fan owned Football Club.

JRFC fans idea of fan ownership was highlighted a few weeks ago in the Non-League Paper when an unnamed businessman failed to travel to Stamford to discuss investment, for which their on paper chairman showed disappointment and disbelief.
Investment in what exactly, what assets do JRFC have that's worth investing in other than a the washing machine?

Lets look at the facts...

How could JRFC benefit from merger with 1874?
1874 Amazing passionate fanbase?
1874 Healthy Bank balance?
1874 Annually Audited Accounts?
1874 Awesome Board of Directors?
1874 Superb dedicated Volunteers?
1874 High moral principles?
1874 Strong aims and objectives?
1874 Fantastic reputation?
1874 Huge respect?
1874 New history?

How could 1874 benefit from merger with JRFC?
Vics History?

That's it but even that comes at the price of paying off all their bills and debts to the Administrator, current creditors, historical creditors and hidden creditors including Rushe. We'd also be doing Jim Rushe a big favour by disbanding 1874.
Well history is memories and we have plenty of those and we can't wipe out the last 15 years of incompetence by the Three Stooges, Connett and Rushe.

So how about this for a compromise.....
Rather than JRFC fans taking the easy option of a merger with 1874. Allow them to take over the club, let them at least experience the hardship of fan ownership, see how they manage for a few seasons and then debate the issue of merger. Surly far better to merge two strong fan owned clubs than dragging along a dead corpse and allowing them to take credit for sticking with the club and allowing them to control our club as their own.

JRFC are still going backwards, 1874 are constantly moving forward, who would really be saving who and at what cost?
 
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This says it all....

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Now every 1874 fan should be asking themselves this question.....

What hurdle have JRFC fans suddenly hit, that has knocked the stuffing and the will to fight out of them?
 
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Merging is clearly a non-starter. Welcoming all Vics fans to our club is the way forward. How about honouring their season tickets (if they sold any) at Barton Stadium for the rest of the season or formally inviting them to join us for a game? If they still exist next season how about a summer friendly?
 
An amalgamation with Vics (even if it were practical, which I doubt) would bring nothing that is not available now.
For £5 anyone can enter the ground now and be fully involved in everything that is happening. Again, if they want to become owners that is also immediately available.
The underlying issue is attracting Vics fans when they fold, probably at the end of the season. I'll go along with any initiative that offers them a way back into what is, in reality, the Vics family of 143 years. However, let's not forget that there are also a handful of lying, deceitful people who have sought to destroy 74 and personally attacked some people who run our club who never post on here, have never commented on Vics and who have more integrity in their little finger than those people will have in their entire lives.
If they want to pay £5 and watch fine - one can easily choose to stand away from them, but to be officially involved? Some of that group are the people you would need to deal with and, presumably, 'amalgamate' into the current board? For me that would end my association with 74 at every level, as a ST holder, an owner, 50/50 club, programme contributor and supporter.
 
a message for Chubbs " he cannot believe that archie has suggested this and referred to me as sarcastically as Vigil Caine (newish member ???) inferring what ! that I am not entitled to an opinion.I am a new member to the forum but I can assure you I have followed local football for a lot longer than you have,and followed 1874 since it was formed.you should respect other peoples views and opinions and accept you may not be right all the time
 
virgil caine said:
a message for Chubbs " he cannot believe that archie has suggested this and referred to me as sarcastically as Vigil Caine (newish member ???) inferring what ! that I am not entitled to an opinion.I am a new member to the forum but I can assure you I have followed local football for a lot longer than you have,and followed 1874 since it was formed.you should respect other peoples views and opinions and accept you may not be right all the time
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He does this. If you don't agree with him he tries to discredit you.

You wouldn't believe he's actually an adult!

For me, I think it's an awful idea. 1874 have something very unique and special - shouldn't be contaminated with the toxic vics brand.
 
I'm on the against side 100%. The board are far too sensible to even consider this anyway.
I'm also on the side of making any vics supporter welcome if, and I still use the word if, they not longer exist come the summer.
The plight of the young lad with cancer the other day put a perspective on things, there are far more important things than petty squabbles in football. And we've all been petty recently me included.
Everyone deserves a second chance and I think all should be made welcome as new supporters.
The board positions are decided on votes and that's how it should continue thus having the people in charge that we want.
 
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