Lockdowns

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James Wood

Too much time on my hands
Jun 1, 2017
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I agree with James on the first point, For anyone who doesn't have access to outside space then the last 12 months must have been quite traumatic - and to be fair completely unsustainable.

In the first lockdown folks were allowed out for an hour per day for exercise (or something akin to that) and I for one wouldn't and couldn't have adhered to that had I been living in an apartment. I think the emphasis all along should have been more on keeping distance and personal responsibility, but as ever the case many people look to "the rules" because firstly they can't think for themselves and secondly to give them an "out" when they don't comply. People give each other Covid - not governments !

The second part of his post where James drifts from keeping the Virus under control, which I do agree with, into an all out attack on the government, which as you might expect I don't agree with. There are a thousand and one reasons why the pandemic has hit the UK badly - and yes deaths are the worst in Europe, but when this is all over I don't think we will be seen not to be hugely out of step with France, Italy and Spain and there will be some huge credits on the other side of the balance sheet. Not least of which will be vaccinations.
As I’ve already said, the vaccination programme has been the one shining star in the whole sorry mess that is this government’s handling of the pandemic.

Everyone - and I mean everyone - involved in this deserves a massive pat on the back from everyone in the U.K.

I just wonder if the Chancellor will find a way to reward those in our brilliant NHS who have worked so hard in the last 12 months with a pay rise? 🤫
 

Andy

Too much time on my hands
Jul 28, 2013
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As I’ve already said, the vaccination programme has been the one shining star in the whole sorry mess that is this government’s handling of the pandemic.

Everyone - and I mean everyone - involved in this deserves a massive pat on the back from everyone in the U.K.

I just wonder if the Chancellor will find a way to reward those in our brilliant NHS who have worked so hard in the last 12 months with a pay rise? 🤫

Nurses certainly deserve pay rises. They’ve more than pulled their weight this last year. That can’t be said about everyone in the NHS however. Many illnesses have gone seemingly ignored by GPs.
 

Knutsfordian

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Dec 18, 2014
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As I’ve already said, the vaccination programme has been the one shining star in the whole sorry mess that is this government’s handling of the pandemic.

Everyone - and I mean everyone - involved in this deserves a massive pat on the back from everyone in the U.K.

I just wonder if the Chancellor will find a way to reward those in our brilliant NHS who have worked so hard in the last 12 months with a pay rise? 🤫
I think the government have already committed to pay rises for the NHS, so not sure where this non story has come from.

In addition I would be inclined to give them all an extra month off to be taken over the next couple of years. Still wouldn't come close to the entitlement of our poor downtrodden teachers who can't find it in themselves to put some extra shifts in over the summer holidays without making much ado.
 

James Wood

Too much time on my hands
Jun 1, 2017
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I think the government have already committed to pay rises for the NHS, so not sure where this non story has come from.

In addition I would be inclined to give them all an extra month off to be taken over the next couple of years. Still wouldn't come close to the entitlement of our poor downtrodden teachers who can't find it in themselves to put some extra shifts in over the summer holidays without making much ado.
Again Knutsfordian you speak from a position of utter ignorance.

I have a very good friend who is a teacher and over the last few months they’ve hardly been sat on their arses doing nothing. The vast majority have been involved in trying to ensure that some level of teaching is being provided in these difficult times to all kids, many of whom have little or no access to the kinds of IT that better off families have that enable their children to keep up with their schooling.

In addition they have also had to cope with the absolute shambles of last year’s GCSE and A level results and the waste of time and resources of the premature, ill thought out and eventually shambolic attempt to get pupils back into school before Christmas.

Another genius decision by the amazing gifted Education Secretary. That noose around his neck must be feeling increasingly tight.
 
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Knutsfordian

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Dec 18, 2014
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Again Knutsfordian you speak from a position of utter ignorance.

I have a very good friend who is a teacher and over the last few months they’ve hardly been sat on their arses doing nothing. The vast majority have been involved in trying to ensure that some level of teaching is being provided in these difficult times to all kids, many of whom have little or no access to the kinds of IT that better off families have that enable their children to keep up with their schooling.

In addition they have also had to cope with the absolute shambles of last year’s GCSE and A level results and the waste of time and resources of the premature, ill thought out and eventually shambolic attempt to get pupils back into school before Christmas.

Another genius decision by the amazing gifted Education Secretary. That noose around his neck must be feeling increasingly tight.
I didn't refer to any of that.

All I referred to was the unwillingness of the teachers (unions mainly) to do something extraordinary for once in generations and put the children's education first this summer.

They may have had their normal routines disrupted, but nothing on the scale of the NHS staff.
 
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Andy

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Jul 28, 2013
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This article is something that needs to be resolved urgently, for a number of reasons.

Firstly, and most importantly, it’s heartbreaking and down right disrespectful to thousands of families to see their loved ones death wrongly labelled to boost someone’s statistics.

Also, inaccuracy of the number of deaths is causing people genuine stress and fear. We shouldn’t be throwing peoples mental health under the bus.

Weirdly there will be resistance from people not wanting this issue to be sorted. Usually from deranged people who just want to use an inaccurate figure to play political games. Awful

 

James Wood

Too much time on my hands
Jun 1, 2017
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This article is something that needs to be resolved urgently, for a number of reasons.

Firstly, and most importantly, it’s heartbreaking and down right disrespectful to thousands of families to see their loved ones death wrongly labelled to boost someone’s statistics.

Also, inaccuracy of the number of deaths is causing people genuine stress and fear. We shouldn’t be throwing peoples mental health under the bus.

Weirdly there will be resistance from people not wanting this issue to be sorted. Usually from deranged people who just want to use an inaccurate figure to play political games. Awful

Strange how you want to have this issue sorted ‘urgently’ but you and your friend Knutsfordian don’t want urgent inquiries into the reason why we’ve so many excess deaths in the first instance, why we didn’t take action to lockdown given the events in Spain and Italy and the double scandal re PPE.

As I say, strange
 

Andy

Too much time on my hands
Jul 28, 2013
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Strange how you want to have this issue sorted ‘urgently’ but you and your friend Knutsfordian don’t want urgent inquiries into the reason why we’ve so many excess deaths in the first instance, why we didn’t take action to lockdown given the events in Spain and Italy and the double scandal re PPE.

As I say, strange

calm down?

you've totally missed the point
 

Knutsfordian

Too much time on my hands
Dec 18, 2014
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Strange how you want to have this issue sorted ‘urgently’ but you and your friend Knutsfordian don’t want urgent inquiries into the reason why we’ve so many excess deaths in the first instance, why we didn’t take action to lockdown given the events in Spain and Italy and the double scandal re PPE.

As I say, strange
That's not a fair summary of what I have said James. I have consistently said that there will be an inquiry into the pandemic at some point at which the reasons for the high number of deaths in this country would become apparent, as I feel that they aren't all resulting from government policy as some people have claimed and consequently ministers have been unfairly blamed and criticised. Time will tell whether that proves to be the case (or not).
 

James Wood

Too much time on my hands
Jun 1, 2017
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That's not a fair summary of what I have said James. I have consistently said that there will be an inquiry into the pandemic at some point at which the reasons for the high number of deaths in this country would become apparent, as I feel that they aren't all resulting from government policy as some people have claimed and consequently ministers have been unfairly blamed and criticised. Time will tell whether that proves to be the case (or not).
Knutsfordian- I think that the sleep must still be in your eyes. My response was in response to a post from Andy, not you!
 

Alan M

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Jun 24, 2013
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Not much to add to all the above. The staged easing of restrictions looks broadly sensible, though everyone (media and public) has focused on dates not data despite the supposed intention for it to be the other way round. Agree with Knutsfordian that people seem to be regarding vaccination rollout success as a sign it's all over. If people can be sensible, we may avoid further waves, but there are always some who take it too far and risk causing spikes.

Not sure about all the people rushing to book holidays abroad though. For one thing they can't be sure that all their destination countries will be as unlocked as we might be by then, or will be willing to accept part-vaccinated people.

As for education catch-up, a few weeks over summer is not going to make much difference. It's a much more long-term issue. And how does this align with the urge to go on holiday? Will families with children be prevented from taking a holiday because of the need to go to school? And school staff too? Wilshaw (ex Ofsted) telling teachers they need to make sacrifices like NHS staff have done is not helping. These are teachers who have practically beeen doing double shifts for a year, with schools open for vulnerable/key worker pupils while trying to teach the rest remotely - where equipment has been available/provided.
 

Knutsfordian

Too much time on my hands
Dec 18, 2014
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Not much to add to all the above. The staged easing of restrictions looks broadly sensible, though everyone (media and public) has focused on dates not data despite the supposed intention for it to be the other way round. Agree with Knutsfordian that people seem to be regarding vaccination rollout success as a sign it's all over. If people can be sensible, we may avoid further waves, but there are always some who take it too far and risk causing spikes.

Not sure about all the people rushing to book holidays abroad though. For one thing they can't be sure that all their destination countries will be as unlocked as we might be by then, or will be willing to accept part-vaccinated people.

As for education catch-up, a few weeks over summer is not going to make much difference. It's a much more long-term issue. And how does this align with the urge to go on holiday? Will families with children be prevented from taking a holiday because of the need to go to school? And school staff too? Wilshaw (ex Ofsted) telling teachers they need to make sacrifices like NHS staff have done is not helping. These are teachers who have practically beeen doing double shifts for a year, with schools open for vulnerable/key worker pupils while trying to teach the rest remotely - where equipment has been available/provided.
I agree with much of what you say, but my point about the teaching catch up is that the whole education sector could do with just a bit of a rethink about how they can get our youngsters back up to speed. Cancelling summer holidays is not the whole answer, but perhaps part of a more flexible school year (or 2) where there are less holidays overall and more time in the class room.

I appreciate teachers will argue they have worked as hard as usual, with a few curved balls thrown into the mix, but there has to be more we can do than is currently proposed. I also don't see the teaching unions coming forward with suggestions as to what they "can do", only "can nots" . This is s once in a lifetime (hopefully) event and I may be in a minority of 1 in saying that I expect far more of a profession whose aims are to give our young people the best education they possible can. Its also very difficult to make any reasonable argument as any criticism of the teaching profession is decried as heresy.

With regard to holidays, I absolutely agree with you. I also can't understand how families with unvaccinated children think they will be allowed to travel to countries where, as you say, vaccination levels are almost certainly not going to be at the same point as the UK. Under 16s may not be badly affected by the virus but they can certainly pass it on.
 

Andy

Too much time on my hands
Jul 28, 2013
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Cases have fell faster than expected and the vaccines are working better than expected.

Growing pressure on the government to ease restrictions faster after stressing “Data not Dates” when announcing the road map back to normality.

A good headache for the government to have.
 

Andy

Too much time on my hands
Jul 28, 2013
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Number of EU countries now announcing that they will now stop administering the AZ vaccine.

Very strange decision, just 13 out of 11,000,000 in the UK have developed Blood Clots. Which is lower than the rate of blood clots that develop in none vaccinated people.

For reference, there has been 15 blood clots reported from Pfizer vaccines, from the over 10,000,000 of those administered in the UK. These countries are contributing to use this vaccine.

It’s strange to see the antivax rhetoric coming from some countries in the EU towards the AZ vaccine.

There public spat with AZ is becoming increasing embarrassing for them.
 

Edge

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Jun 24, 2013
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If you're interested in stats that have no definite link to the vaccines... Here's the link to the adverse reactions reported


Can't find the link but I think the FT said more people on the placebo reported side effects than those who had the actual vaccine!
 

Knutsfordian

Too much time on my hands
Dec 18, 2014
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Number of EU countries now announcing that they will now stop administering the AZ vaccine.

Very strange decision, just 13 out of 11,000,000 in the UK have developed Blood Clots. Which is lower than the rate of blood clots that develop in none vaccinated people.

For reference, there has been 15 blood clots reported from Pfizer vaccines, from the over 10,000,000 of those administered in the UK. These countries are contributing to use this vaccine.

It’s strange to see the antivax rhetoric coming from some countries in the EU towards the AZ vaccine.

There public spat with AZ is becoming increasing embarrassing for them.
So how many people have actually died as a result of those blood clots? Given that pre vaccination our death rates were peaking at about 1200 per day and they are now circa 50 it seems to be a no brainer to carry on with the vaccination programme.

The reaction by EU countries which is out of step with the medical agencies does seem disproportionate, which considering they are always banging on about standards makes you think some of this stuff is political rather than medical
 

Andy

Too much time on my hands
Jul 28, 2013
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So how many people have actually died as a result of those blood clots? Given that pre vaccination our death rates were peaking at about 1200 per day and they are now circa 50 it seems to be a no brainer to carry on with the vaccination programme.

The reaction by EU countries which is out of step with the medical agencies does seem disproportionate, which considering they are always banging on about standards makes you think some of this stuff is political rather than medical

I can’t find the article again, but from memory it was 1 from each vaccine, but don’t quote me on that.

But from the 17m administers in the UK and EU just 37 cases reported (thats 0.0002%).

So there are over the counter painkillers more likely to cause bloodclots

Really strange to see countries who are already struggling to to roll out vaccines, and are struggling to get the most vulnerable to take the vaccine further this dangerous rhetoric against AZ.

Is it political? Playing games with the lives of their own citizens? Very strange
 
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