No vote round here but I'd say from a national outlook, it could have been better for Labour and the Tories and could have been worse. A 'draw' if you ask me with both getting the same share of the vote. UKIP certainly the nights big losers and have been virtually wiped out while the Lib Dems performed reasonably well and may slowly be on the rise again. No real surprises though and most seats have remained the same.
Local elections 2018
- Thread starter Ben
- Start date
I would say biggest losers have to be Labour. Opposition to a weak government and a weak Prime Minister, they have failed to make significant gains. We can only speculate why but when Blair was up against Major in the 90s in a similar situation he wiped the floor with the Tories. They must be disappointed.
- Jun 24, 2013
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Lib Dem take control of South Cambs Council. Popular opinion suggests they fancy their chances of putting Heidi Allen MP 16k Conservative majority to the test come the next General Election. Lofty ambitions mostly certainly, but to be honest given her voting record on certain crucial issues, it would be no bad thing if they succeeded.
- Thread starter
- #4
The result could have been better I accept.
A few things damaged the Labour vote for me.
1) Collapse of UKIP vote benefited Tories more.
2) Brexit - leave voting areas in Northern and Southern towns were more likely to back the Tories.
3) The anti-semitism row would have lost Labour votes among traditional Jewish voters in Barnet for instance, a seat they could have won.
4) Jeremy Corbyn - some voters can't bring themselves to vote for him even if they don't necessarily like the Tories.
These are just a couple of things Labour need to work on if they want to give themselves a chance of winning the next general election.
The trouble is the core labour support outside of metropolitan London voted for Brexit and while they might want a labour government, they don’t want a socialist/Marxist one. Corbyn would never get a majority, but has a chance in coalition with SNP at next GE. Would he be too old though? Someone like Andy Burnham or Chuka Umunna would have wiped the floor with the Tories yesterday.
- Dec 18, 2014
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I think its a fallacy to label all Brexit voters as conservative or even mainly conservative. I think most of the hard core labour support (especially in older age groups) is anti EU. Labour was an anti-EU party until the 90's, changed its policy but never converted its supporters. If Labour were to be in office I think there would be as many splits in the party as there are in the Conservatives. What's holding the line is their desire to bring about a new general election rather than allowing for a consensus on Brexit
- Jun 24, 2013
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You’ll struggle to find many Labour voters around these parts that voted for Brexit, though you’ll struggle to find many voters of any party that voted for it.
Nice to see the Tories got well and truly dumped on in South Cambs. Maybe the tide is turning.
The LE results were not even a fraction as bad for Labour as MSM wanted everyone to believe. They’re almost as corrupt and as bent with reporting figures as the government and they set one heck of a high barrier.
Nice to see the Tories got well and truly dumped on in South Cambs. Maybe the tide is turning.
The LE results were not even a fraction as bad for Labour as MSM wanted everyone to believe. They’re almost as corrupt and as bent with reporting figures as the government and they set one heck of a high barrier.
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- #8
I agree, Nicki. If you think that Labour got just 27 per cent of the vote in the last local elections, this year is some turnaround from then to get 35 per cent of the vote. You don't see that being depicted in the right-wing media coverage though. I'd love to see what the reaction would be if a Tory party in opposition got the result Labour did. I doubt it would be so negative.
Although I'd agree with you Knutsfordian that a significant number of old Labour voters backed Brexit, two thirds of all people who voted Labour in the 2015 election voted remain in the EU referendum. The membership is overwhelmingly pro-EU.
If Corbyn came out and campaigned to stay in the single market and customs union to differentiate the party totally from the Tories, it would be a huge vote winner for me. The ambiguity of let's please remainers and leavers isn't working as effectively now. He needs to come out with a clear policy. Labour is a pro-EU party on the whole at all levels and far less divided than the Tories and Corbyn should reflect that in his Brexit stance.
Although I'd agree with you Knutsfordian that a significant number of old Labour voters backed Brexit, two thirds of all people who voted Labour in the 2015 election voted remain in the EU referendum. The membership is overwhelmingly pro-EU.
If Corbyn came out and campaigned to stay in the single market and customs union to differentiate the party totally from the Tories, it would be a huge vote winner for me. The ambiguity of let's please remainers and leavers isn't working as effectively now. He needs to come out with a clear policy. Labour is a pro-EU party on the whole at all levels and far less divided than the Tories and Corbyn should reflect that in his Brexit stance.
- Jun 24, 2013
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Whichever party is at the helm, neither will be able to make any sense of negotiating brexit because that is the nature of the beast, and neither will be able to please all factions of their own party, let alone even a small minority of the UK population, because few people are in the mood to compromise.
It's a mess, not only in both main parties but also across the country, but it's just one of many, and it is doing its utmost to get in the way of sorting out all the other messes in other areas of our lives which governments are supposed to deal with rather than create.
As for the local elections, I don't think either side was particularly jubilant, and rightly so. And anyway, it was not the whole UK (nothing happened down here), and the turnout was pitifully low. Labour improved slightly on its showing at the previous vote for the same areas, but made the mistake of suggesting it might take some die-hard Tory strongholds in London where it has never stood much chance. The Conservatives were thus able to crow about this to disguise feelings of relief. Meanwhile, at least the UKIP vote collapsed, which is a small comfort, though of course in many cases that just probably boosted the Tory vote. All in all, these elections are quite possibly already old news.
It's a mess, not only in both main parties but also across the country, but it's just one of many, and it is doing its utmost to get in the way of sorting out all the other messes in other areas of our lives which governments are supposed to deal with rather than create.
As for the local elections, I don't think either side was particularly jubilant, and rightly so. And anyway, it was not the whole UK (nothing happened down here), and the turnout was pitifully low. Labour improved slightly on its showing at the previous vote for the same areas, but made the mistake of suggesting it might take some die-hard Tory strongholds in London where it has never stood much chance. The Conservatives were thus able to crow about this to disguise feelings of relief. Meanwhile, at least the UKIP vote collapsed, which is a small comfort, though of course in many cases that just probably boosted the Tory vote. All in all, these elections are quite possibly already old news.
- Jul 28, 2013
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It was probably the must uninteresting election in recent years. Nothing happened really.
Labour did well in London, but not as well as they expected.
The Tories did well outside of London but not as well as they could have.
The Lib Dem’s won votes on the back of both main parties being in a bad state as expected
And UKIP continued their decline in to extinction as expected.
The only remotely interesting thing to happen this election is seeing a lot of Momentum’s councillors lose. Hopefully Momentum join Ukip in their decline in to oblivion.
Labour did well in London, but not as well as they expected.
The Tories did well outside of London but not as well as they could have.
The Lib Dem’s won votes on the back of both main parties being in a bad state as expected
And UKIP continued their decline in to extinction as expected.
The only remotely interesting thing to happen this election is seeing a lot of Momentum’s councillors lose. Hopefully Momentum join Ukip in their decline in to oblivion.
- Dec 18, 2014
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I am not sure how you would know that two thirds of all labour voters voted remain - certainly not my experience - but all I can think is that of 17 million plus people who voted for Brexit and given the sizeable chunk of SNP, Lib Dems and Conservative remainers, a large proportion of labour voters must have voted to leave. I agree with Alan M though, it is a mess and the consequences are probably going to be the worst of both worlds - not fully out but paying in with none of the benefits of having exited the EU.
On balance. I think the Tories will be happier than Labour about the result. Given the crushing indictment regarding the Windrush debacle and losing Amber Rudd for falling foul of a select committee, together with the continued loss of cabinet ministers at various points, one would have expected Labour to do far better. I think the tide is turning against Corbyn and it will be interesting to see whether in the next election Momentum can deliver the same impetus against a Conservative party that surely can't be so hapless. We may not have long to wait to find out !
On balance. I think the Tories will be happier than Labour about the result. Given the crushing indictment regarding the Windrush debacle and losing Amber Rudd for falling foul of a select committee, together with the continued loss of cabinet ministers at various points, one would have expected Labour to do far better. I think the tide is turning against Corbyn and it will be interesting to see whether in the next election Momentum can deliver the same impetus against a Conservative party that surely can't be so hapless. We may not have long to wait to find out !
- Thread starter
- #12
Knutsfordian, the figures came from You Gov. They show 65 per cent of people who voted Labour at the 2015 General Election voted remain in the EU referendum. This compares to just 39 per cent of Tory voters. Surely this shows that Brexit was very much something orchestrated by the right of British politics? A clear majority of Labour supporters back remain and therefore a single market and customs union, so why will Corbyn not support this? To not do so risks losing votes to the Lib Dems, who currently are the most pro-EU party. Back the single market and a customs union and they'll be a majority in parliament for it (many Tory rebels). The more May sucks up to the Brexit loons on the right of her party, the greater the chance exactly this will happen and we get a soft Brexit. https://yougov.co.uk/news/2016/06/27/how-britain-voted/
As for the tide turning against Corbyn, that remains to be seen. Reading into local election results should be treated with caution. Look at how badly Labour did at the last local election and then they surprised everyone with a better than expected General Election.
As for the tide turning against Corbyn, that remains to be seen. Reading into local election results should be treated with caution. Look at how badly Labour did at the last local election and then they surprised everyone with a better than expected General Election.
- Thread starter
- #13
I don't think that's going to happen anytime soon. Labour have a huge movement of hundreds of thousands of people and they are at the centre of this. Nor do they stand for one single issue like UKIP do and not are they anywhere near as unsavoury. They stand for the opposite of what UKIP stand for.
There are elements of the movement that I'm uncomfortable with and they need rooting out. But what Momentum are is a great campaigning force and were the biggest single reason why Labour performed above expectation in the General Election. Labour won seats where they were present. I think there is general fear in the Tory ranks at the impact of Momentum, so no wonder they attract so much criticism.
- Dec 18, 2014
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You Gov is a polling/market research company - and like many others you can't take their polls as an absolute fact more of an indication I would say.
In any event 17.4 million people voted to leave the EU and I would proffer that the vast majority of those people are ordinary working people who haven't been lead along a path, screaming and kicking by an orchestrated right wing campaign to make a deluded decision. Those 17.4 million people voted to leave the single market and the customs union - and I think Corbyn at least recognises this. His problem is that he has been persuaded by his front bench team that we can have a customs union and still have free trade (or something akin to that) with other countries and I am not sure the EU will swallow that one. 17.4 million people want out, voted out and that's what we should get.
One final point. Over the past 40 years the pro-eu lobbies have had it all their own way, with a total disregard for the large numbers of UK people who didn't want EU membership beyond the initial joining of a common market. For 40 years their views have been totally ignored and repressed. Whatever happens now, even if Brexit fails this time, it will come back again and again. The relationship between the UK and EU will never be the cosy relationship it has been in the past
In any event 17.4 million people voted to leave the EU and I would proffer that the vast majority of those people are ordinary working people who haven't been lead along a path, screaming and kicking by an orchestrated right wing campaign to make a deluded decision. Those 17.4 million people voted to leave the single market and the customs union - and I think Corbyn at least recognises this. His problem is that he has been persuaded by his front bench team that we can have a customs union and still have free trade (or something akin to that) with other countries and I am not sure the EU will swallow that one. 17.4 million people want out, voted out and that's what we should get.
One final point. Over the past 40 years the pro-eu lobbies have had it all their own way, with a total disregard for the large numbers of UK people who didn't want EU membership beyond the initial joining of a common market. For 40 years their views have been totally ignored and repressed. Whatever happens now, even if Brexit fails this time, it will come back again and again. The relationship between the UK and EU will never be the cosy relationship it has been in the past
- Jun 24, 2013
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And to be fair, for precisely that reason it is somewhat disingenuous of certain aspects of the Leave camp (not you!) to tell those who voted Remain to shut up, accept the decision, stop betraying the country, get behind the government's plan etc etc. For a start, there doesn't seem to be much of a plan to get behind. I would contend that all sides believe that they have the country's best interests at heart, but that they fundamentally disagree on how to achieve that aim (as indeed do those in government).
Not sure how cosy the relationship has ever been between the UK and the EU though - we've had so many opt-outs over the years.
Not sure how cosy the relationship has ever been between the UK and the EU though - we've had so many opt-outs over the years.
- Dec 18, 2014
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Cosy enough to get Mastricht and Lisbon treaties through Parliament with a lot of collusion from pro EU politicians
There'll be plenty of treaties (or the like) in Lisbon tomorrow, it's Eurovision.
- Jul 31, 2013
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